Thank you for sharing your experience here Jess. Good to read about it. I definitely get feeling tired/less than well and this making one irritable/snappy with others. Some days it just happens, and it can be tougher not to take things personally at such times than it might at other times. I was that way the other day with a friend (who explained to me a while back that he is on the sociopathy spectrum). I still feel pretty bad about it personally (though I know I need to let it go).
Out of interest what was the simple communication change kind you requested? Or is that something you and Athena prefer to be kept private? If so no probs. I was just curious!
You said taking off ur mask( even though it is never 100% off) causes people to become extremely uneasy and downright terrified. What do u exactly do when u say u wear the mask. Is there a certain way u keep ur eyes, eyebrows, mouth? I cannot imagine how u are able to do so constantly. Also, I think ur face without mask is just a very very relaxed face, with absolutely no tension in any facial muscle . There is always some emotional state our face conveys, like microexpressions, which shows an insight into our 'inner world ' , because we are always feeling something, some emotion. But that being absent in your case, I think people feel that absence very much.
Basically, wearing sunglasses achieves this for NTs to some degree I think. Sunglasses on a stoic face conceals a lot of facial cues, so standing in an empty elevator with such a person sounds terrifying. Perhaps it is your eyes that does the trick mostly. Completely relaxing the eyes without closing them would achieve this mask off look, and that is perhaps the most difficult part of this mask off face for an NT to achieve.
I adjust to the situation I am in. Microexpressions are something that I have to pay careful attention to in regard to the mask. What is necessary, and what isn't to keep from unnerving those around me.
Wow. You are able to school microexpressions too? Sounds exhausting. I completely understand why you wouldn't want to deal with people any more than you have to.
But you have to decide on a line, haven't you? Between how much you are willing to do to get along, and where you decide to put your foot down. Like buttering up a superior, or following a trendy fashion,or in general doing something that everyone is doing.
When you do put your foot down, do people get surprised? Though I think more often than not, it makes people more... amenable to you? Like instead of becoming an outcast, you are more like revered for this? Did I explain that well?
Thank you for taking the time to write these posts. It really is awesome to see what I feel is an example of what real friendship is supposed to be like for everyone, real and committed to understanding and helping each other grow.
I try and tell people that life's like a garden, and you got to do the hard stuff when it doesn't seem worth it to get to the good stuff. Yall get it. Most people throw down the hoe not even halfway through the row. You both have a beautiful garden to show for the work you have put in.
This is great. I am impressed that you are able to comprehend and make changes as required. What I mean is that occasionally within my family I have stopped family members told them exactly what they were doing and why it doesn’t work on me. They then give me a blank stare and double down on what I just told them I was aware that they were doing and why it wouldn’t work. The sort of honesty I see you and Athena having is really commendable.
Thank you so much for your comment. We all work towards a common goal, and communication is key. I think most are really good at talking TO another, but it's the listening that makes it difficult for some. We have to learn to listen and take the time to process before responding. Talking WITH each other, instead of at. It's sounds easy, right? An example...I would attempt conversation with blood relatives, but could already see the wheels turning before I was finished making my point.
Thank you for taking the time and effort to share that with us. It makes me really happy to see real friendship, and as someone who has followed Athena for a very long time, I’m happy that she has you. I’m also truly happy that you have her. You both sound like you are worth the investment in friendship.
I feel very lucky to have her in my life. Both she and her SO. Funny thing, I won them during my divorce. Not kidding! I have lived with them longer than I did with my EX. Loyalty. I think some have forgotten what that is...
Thank you for sharing your experience here Jess. Good to read about it. I definitely get feeling tired/less than well and this making one irritable/snappy with others. Some days it just happens, and it can be tougher not to take things personally at such times than it might at other times. I was that way the other day with a friend (who explained to me a while back that he is on the sociopathy spectrum). I still feel pretty bad about it personally (though I know I need to let it go).
Out of interest what was the simple communication change kind you requested? Or is that something you and Athena prefer to be kept private? If so no probs. I was just curious!
You said taking off ur mask( even though it is never 100% off) causes people to become extremely uneasy and downright terrified. What do u exactly do when u say u wear the mask. Is there a certain way u keep ur eyes, eyebrows, mouth? I cannot imagine how u are able to do so constantly. Also, I think ur face without mask is just a very very relaxed face, with absolutely no tension in any facial muscle . There is always some emotional state our face conveys, like microexpressions, which shows an insight into our 'inner world ' , because we are always feeling something, some emotion. But that being absent in your case, I think people feel that absence very much.
Basically, wearing sunglasses achieves this for NTs to some degree I think. Sunglasses on a stoic face conceals a lot of facial cues, so standing in an empty elevator with such a person sounds terrifying. Perhaps it is your eyes that does the trick mostly. Completely relaxing the eyes without closing them would achieve this mask off look, and that is perhaps the most difficult part of this mask off face for an NT to achieve.
Let me know your thoughts on this.
I adjust to the situation I am in. Microexpressions are something that I have to pay careful attention to in regard to the mask. What is necessary, and what isn't to keep from unnerving those around me.
Wow. You are able to school microexpressions too? Sounds exhausting. I completely understand why you wouldn't want to deal with people any more than you have to.
But you have to decide on a line, haven't you? Between how much you are willing to do to get along, and where you decide to put your foot down. Like buttering up a superior, or following a trendy fashion,or in general doing something that everyone is doing.
Oh yes, there is a point where I'm done.
When you do put your foot down, do people get surprised? Though I think more often than not, it makes people more... amenable to you? Like instead of becoming an outcast, you are more like revered for this? Did I explain that well?
Yes actually. I will put up a post about this soon.
That was a well-written and interesting post, I enjoyed Jess' perspective on Athena. Cheers.
Thank you and cheers!
Well good post Jess and Athena,you can learn from Athena many stuff.
We learn from each other. Every single day we work towards individual and common goals.
Thank you for taking the time to write these posts. It really is awesome to see what I feel is an example of what real friendship is supposed to be like for everyone, real and committed to understanding and helping each other grow.
Thank you. It's not always easy, but nothing worth having is.
Very true.
I try and tell people that life's like a garden, and you got to do the hard stuff when it doesn't seem worth it to get to the good stuff. Yall get it. Most people throw down the hoe not even halfway through the row. You both have a beautiful garden to show for the work you have put in.
I really like that gardening analogy. And yes, nailed it! Thank you so much!
This is great. I am impressed that you are able to comprehend and make changes as required. What I mean is that occasionally within my family I have stopped family members told them exactly what they were doing and why it doesn’t work on me. They then give me a blank stare and double down on what I just told them I was aware that they were doing and why it wouldn’t work. The sort of honesty I see you and Athena having is really commendable.
Thank you so much for your comment. We all work towards a common goal, and communication is key. I think most are really good at talking TO another, but it's the listening that makes it difficult for some. We have to learn to listen and take the time to process before responding. Talking WITH each other, instead of at. It's sounds easy, right? An example...I would attempt conversation with blood relatives, but could already see the wheels turning before I was finished making my point.
I virtually met Athena on Quora many years ago. I've always being impressed about how she knows herself and her no-bullshit approach on things.
Well said! One of the many things I love and appreciate about her.
Thank you for taking the time and effort to share that with us. It makes me really happy to see real friendship, and as someone who has followed Athena for a very long time, I’m happy that she has you. I’m also truly happy that you have her. You both sound like you are worth the investment in friendship.
I feel very lucky to have her in my life. Both she and her SO. Funny thing, I won them during my divorce. Not kidding! I have lived with them longer than I did with my EX. Loyalty. I think some have forgotten what that is...