Hey Athena, could you write a post about your boundaries in relationships with long term partners? Specifically your views on fuck boys and narcissitc types who mess women around? What to look out for, what makes them tick, what prevents people getting abused by them etc. This is especially for people who have abandonment issues and to help them protect themselves. How do you respond to being chatted up? What would you do if you saw your man flirting with someone else? Would it bother you? If not why not? So much can be written about this subject on conquering men who want to mess women around. Thanks and Happy New year.
Hmm, I have no experience with this, as I have no tolerance or patience for any of it. None of my past partners would do anything of the sort, as they would be removed immediately. I have no time for people like this, so I wouldn't date them. I do not tolerate cheating of any sort. I consider it a sign of weak character. There is no apology that is accepted for it, and there is no discussion to be had. There are no second chances. They would be gone before the sun sets.
Accommodating a person in my life when I am perfectly happy alone is not something that I will do lightly. If I do so, and that effort is disrespected, the effort is withdrawn, and the person is removed.
I don't know why people get into relationships like that. My only guess is that they require companionship and are willing to tolerate such things because they are willing to accept it rather than face being alone.
Yes, I agree that cutting them off the first sign of trouble would be the way forward, however what about if they start off being great? (love bombing) I have found myself a couple years into a relationship a few times now, only to realise suddenly that they changed to a lesser person and I'm suddenly trying harder! How much of this is emotional manipulation and how much is intelligence? I think I'm trying to ask if our emotions are to blame for us staying longer and of you don't feel them, then how you can be affected by cheating? So you would be angry about this? What if they did it well and you suddenly found out, your reaction would be a dead cut off even if you'd been together for years? I'm genuinely interested. I have found the last 8 years that I love e being single but have allowed a couple of guys to convince me to date them, only to realise a couple of yrs in that they are a waste of time and changed (got more moody, became their true selves). How can I avoid this again when in the beginning they start off so well?
If I take the time out of my life to accommodate someone else's needs in a relationship, that effort will be treated with the utmost respect, as it is not something that I require. Betrayal of that, and cheating is certainly exactly that, is an absolute dealbreaker. I am not interested in so much as a conversation. They will be gone before they have even finished their attempt of explaining themselves. I have no time, nor interest, in their excuses. It is disrespect that will not be tolerated.
If you are happy being single, then don't allow them to change your mind. Instead, it should be that you find that their presence improves upon your solitude. It should be someone that doesn't beg for your attention, but rather, someone that earns it from you without being a needy person. It should be on you to desire the change, not them trying to change you.
I say "no"- Like in your other post, your own words spring to life ( like in 99 Red Balloons).
"in the beginning they start off so well" --- yet above "love bombing". Nyet.
Love Bombing is not starting off well. They are letting you know it will change according to a schedule they are on: and is not posted or available to you to see.
Love Bombers = Inauthentic. Phony. Not good for you.
Yes, love bombing, although nice at the time and flattering is actually quite creepy if you think about it as no one can sustain such attention and is obviously trying to over do it for a reason. Thank you to you both.
Thank you for the smile Natasha! I really enjoy your post. Idk in what context Athena would place this, but I agree: VERY interesting if she does!
Round table discussion anyone?
From my POV, fuck boys are "Todds" and they look for "Jane". Jane of the moment, not Jane of the "I want a partner" variety.
The FB on TV, all those nice variety shows highlighting such people, claim to "find Jane" basically at will: 100s of times per year. It appears social media stats support that: About 3-5% of the men "get the action"- And the action is "now" and immediate and in play for the moment.
Let me stop here: New Years Day and all: Is this what you mean?
I grew up in the 70s and "lost count" when I was 19 though I was never a FuckBoy. No one ever mistook me for good looking or rich or any other positive attribute. I am not even "good in bed". There was just so much sex experience available to regular people.
Fuckboys, I respectfully suggest to you, result from USA society and culture. Sexual experiences became rather limited in the early 80s with STDs, AIDs, etc. caused a huge change.
But sex couldn't be held back for long and Fuckboys took the lead: They rack up the big numbers because they give women "what they want".
A sizeable moving factor in the attraction is the woman "knows" the Fuckboy will move on if she does not provide what the Fuckboy wants: In that moment.
Possibly I am all mixed up, but I thought you would permit me of the holiday and all.
Thank you for your response and interesting answer. I love reading Athena's posts and find them so empowered by the fact they don't carry around these useless and sometimes debilitating emotions. I'm really interested to know how I might be responding without them? Can only ask Athena for this information. I have found myself going round and round in relationships, wishing I hadn't bothered and stayed single. I get dragged in by emotion and 'love' and beginning to think that this is just a weakness that I could ignore ne t time round. I'm mean, without love, what makes a person worth of my attention?
TY Natasha for your kind words. Athena is great communicator and does in fact empower us in ways we learn in the experience. She has on occasion told me I am full of shit(!!) but in that empowering way!! haha. I learn about myself from her.
Pardon me if I go right to your last word: "worth of my attention?"
All the girls I dated or lived with or married, I adore(d). They were worthy of my attention bc they were fascinating and wonderful people in their way. All of them were kind and decent. They are an accomplished bunch and done many successful things.
Likely I missed your entire point! None of my relations worked out (they got to know me?) but they are people I admire for who they are and what they do. We usually shared some interests and common goals, political or social, for example.
Ooops. -smiles- Will I sound like a dinosaur asking how you meet guys to date?
Your timing there was spot on. I can think myself down at this time of year. I’m always nervous for what lies ahead, not so much for me but for my parents, kids, and even the dog. I wonder if he’ll be with me next Christmas now that he’s an old boy.
Your post made me laugh, because you’re so immune to thoughts like that. A different perspective. I suppose a topic might be along the lines of ‘ things neurotypicals worry about and why’ and then your view on it. Emotions aren’t logical, sometimes it helps just to hear the logical voice.
Often, I don't know why neurotypicals worry about the things that they do, It makes no sense to me. I might be able to guess the thinking involved, but often I find their focus on things that they cannot control, or things that have already happened, absolutely strange.
As for the things that you list, when those events come to pass, you'll deal with it because you have to. There isn't a choice, but you can't pre-deal with it. As far as I know, it doesn't work that way. As for everyone else in your life, you can worry about them, but they are going to do what they will, and things will happen as they are going to. You can help and support them when they need it, but worry isn't going to change things.
I have a couple of questions for you. From your writing, it seems your childhood was stable, with patient, loving, and decent parents. I recall you mentioning a time when you found yourself in a bit of trouble, which led to your diagnosis, but it seems your intellect helped you avoid deeper pitfalls and develop cognitive empathy.
To what extent do you credit your childhood for your successful adjustment? Or do you think your high stress tolerance would have made it less relevant? Lastly, do you believe the discipline of ballet played a key role in keeping you busy and out of trouble?
Wishing you a year filled with joy, growth, and wonderful adventures!
A suggestion for a post. Your thoughts on why high profile professionals in the mental health field, some of them with impressive credentials, get Psychopathy so wrong. Many associate Psychopathy and Narcissism, mixing up the characteristics of the two. Jordan Peterson has done this a few times as has Dr Todd Grande. You have often referred to Dr Hare being responsible for propagating much of the misunderstanding, but I would have expected better of other professionals who have considerable experience.
I will do a post on this. Unfortunately, not being in that profession, I am not privy to much of what goes on, I have only heard anecdotally about the problems. I can speculate, but I may be wrong in my thoughts
It's not my favourite time of the year. I already have anxiety and the holiday season just makes it worse. All I do is worry and mull over the past and the future. I can't wait for things to get back to normal.
I thought about a post on things about neurotypicals that you still don't understand. And I also have two questions:
- Are we getting more posts on the Human Darkness series?
- How do you fight the boredom/keep yourself busy? I'm sure boredom is a much bigger problem for you but I'm starting to run out of hobbies and could use some tips.
Yes, there are more coming. I just thought that there should be a break for the holidays. As you mentioned, there can be a lot of negative emotions attached to this time of year, so I decided not to add to it.
I can see why it doesn't take the human made creation of a new year to start making fresh positive beginnings. Still, purely out of conditioning/habit, it's definitely when I tend to think the most about it. Hoping it's a reasonably good 2025 for you Athena (I don't imagine you're too bothered about hearing "Happy new year" so I won't say that). Did you tend to have any thoughts at all on any future life goals for yourself towards the end of 2024 or this week? Or weren't you bothered?
I would definitely still be interested to see an article on why you see there's no such as a narcissistic sociopath (although if you've already covered this somewhere I'm not recalling please don't hesitate to say).
Also on this: "This is one of the places that psychopaths and neurotypicals differ, and it becomes a glaring difference every year."
I'd definitely be interested to hear more from you on why it's the glaring difference for you that it is. One thing I have to question is if this might have anything to do with possibly living in the present moment more than neurotypicals.
Mostly, that it matters to anyone at all, for any reason. For me, it's a day, like any other, that requires a change regarding remembering the date has gone up by one. That's it.
In contrast, a lot of people see the New Year as a time for personal promises, reflections, sadness, hope, etc. I don't get that, and I don't get drinking into oblivion because the year rolled over.
My community really takes to party hardy on both Christmas and New Years.
Today as I walked my dog, MANY parties still raged though the sun was long up.
But somehow, there was no restaurant open!! A sign (at my usual place) said open and I went inside.. but only "family". Having made it inside, I though they might at least feed me, or give my dog some water, but...nooo!
Of the coming year, I want to come along on the ride: Be your free and true self to explore where you will. Best wishes to you and all who follow you here.
I don't discuss politics. It is a hard and fast rule of mine. People cannot keep their emotions out of it.
As for religion, you would need to be more specific. I don't adhere to any religion myself, but understand the purpose of it for many people, however. I don't spend much time in reading or learning about different religions anymore. I did a long time ago, but most of that information is lost in the ether.
I know that there is more than this understanding of existence. That much I have seen, but I don't know beyond that. I am fine with not knowing. I know there is more, but what that more is, I have no idea.
Hey Athena, could you write a post about your boundaries in relationships with long term partners? Specifically your views on fuck boys and narcissitc types who mess women around? What to look out for, what makes them tick, what prevents people getting abused by them etc. This is especially for people who have abandonment issues and to help them protect themselves. How do you respond to being chatted up? What would you do if you saw your man flirting with someone else? Would it bother you? If not why not? So much can be written about this subject on conquering men who want to mess women around. Thanks and Happy New year.
Hmm, I have no experience with this, as I have no tolerance or patience for any of it. None of my past partners would do anything of the sort, as they would be removed immediately. I have no time for people like this, so I wouldn't date them. I do not tolerate cheating of any sort. I consider it a sign of weak character. There is no apology that is accepted for it, and there is no discussion to be had. There are no second chances. They would be gone before the sun sets.
Accommodating a person in my life when I am perfectly happy alone is not something that I will do lightly. If I do so, and that effort is disrespected, the effort is withdrawn, and the person is removed.
I don't know why people get into relationships like that. My only guess is that they require companionship and are willing to tolerate such things because they are willing to accept it rather than face being alone.
Yes, I agree that cutting them off the first sign of trouble would be the way forward, however what about if they start off being great? (love bombing) I have found myself a couple years into a relationship a few times now, only to realise suddenly that they changed to a lesser person and I'm suddenly trying harder! How much of this is emotional manipulation and how much is intelligence? I think I'm trying to ask if our emotions are to blame for us staying longer and of you don't feel them, then how you can be affected by cheating? So you would be angry about this? What if they did it well and you suddenly found out, your reaction would be a dead cut off even if you'd been together for years? I'm genuinely interested. I have found the last 8 years that I love e being single but have allowed a couple of guys to convince me to date them, only to realise a couple of yrs in that they are a waste of time and changed (got more moody, became their true selves). How can I avoid this again when in the beginning they start off so well?
If I take the time out of my life to accommodate someone else's needs in a relationship, that effort will be treated with the utmost respect, as it is not something that I require. Betrayal of that, and cheating is certainly exactly that, is an absolute dealbreaker. I am not interested in so much as a conversation. They will be gone before they have even finished their attempt of explaining themselves. I have no time, nor interest, in their excuses. It is disrespect that will not be tolerated.
If you are happy being single, then don't allow them to change your mind. Instead, it should be that you find that their presence improves upon your solitude. It should be someone that doesn't beg for your attention, but rather, someone that earns it from you without being a needy person. It should be on you to desire the change, not them trying to change you.
Thank you, Athena.
Pardon me for comment in advance of Athena reply:
I say "no"- Like in your other post, your own words spring to life ( like in 99 Red Balloons).
"in the beginning they start off so well" --- yet above "love bombing". Nyet.
Love Bombing is not starting off well. They are letting you know it will change according to a schedule they are on: and is not posted or available to you to see.
Love Bombers = Inauthentic. Phony. Not good for you.
Promise to walk my dog now!! Best!
Yes, love bombing, although nice at the time and flattering is actually quite creepy if you think about it as no one can sustain such attention and is obviously trying to over do it for a reason. Thank you to you both.
Thank you for the smile Natasha! I really enjoy your post. Idk in what context Athena would place this, but I agree: VERY interesting if she does!
Round table discussion anyone?
From my POV, fuck boys are "Todds" and they look for "Jane". Jane of the moment, not Jane of the "I want a partner" variety.
The FB on TV, all those nice variety shows highlighting such people, claim to "find Jane" basically at will: 100s of times per year. It appears social media stats support that: About 3-5% of the men "get the action"- And the action is "now" and immediate and in play for the moment.
Let me stop here: New Years Day and all: Is this what you mean?
I grew up in the 70s and "lost count" when I was 19 though I was never a FuckBoy. No one ever mistook me for good looking or rich or any other positive attribute. I am not even "good in bed". There was just so much sex experience available to regular people.
Fuckboys, I respectfully suggest to you, result from USA society and culture. Sexual experiences became rather limited in the early 80s with STDs, AIDs, etc. caused a huge change.
But sex couldn't be held back for long and Fuckboys took the lead: They rack up the big numbers because they give women "what they want".
A sizeable moving factor in the attraction is the woman "knows" the Fuckboy will move on if she does not provide what the Fuckboy wants: In that moment.
Possibly I am all mixed up, but I thought you would permit me of the holiday and all.
Best wishes!
Thank you for your response and interesting answer. I love reading Athena's posts and find them so empowered by the fact they don't carry around these useless and sometimes debilitating emotions. I'm really interested to know how I might be responding without them? Can only ask Athena for this information. I have found myself going round and round in relationships, wishing I hadn't bothered and stayed single. I get dragged in by emotion and 'love' and beginning to think that this is just a weakness that I could ignore ne t time round. I'm mean, without love, what makes a person worth of my attention?
TY Natasha for your kind words. Athena is great communicator and does in fact empower us in ways we learn in the experience. She has on occasion told me I am full of shit(!!) but in that empowering way!! haha. I learn about myself from her.
Pardon me if I go right to your last word: "worth of my attention?"
All the girls I dated or lived with or married, I adore(d). They were worthy of my attention bc they were fascinating and wonderful people in their way. All of them were kind and decent. They are an accomplished bunch and done many successful things.
Likely I missed your entire point! None of my relations worked out (they got to know me?) but they are people I admire for who they are and what they do. We usually shared some interests and common goals, political or social, for example.
Ooops. -smiles- Will I sound like a dinosaur asking how you meet guys to date?
Happy New Year Athena.
Your timing there was spot on. I can think myself down at this time of year. I’m always nervous for what lies ahead, not so much for me but for my parents, kids, and even the dog. I wonder if he’ll be with me next Christmas now that he’s an old boy.
Your post made me laugh, because you’re so immune to thoughts like that. A different perspective. I suppose a topic might be along the lines of ‘ things neurotypicals worry about and why’ and then your view on it. Emotions aren’t logical, sometimes it helps just to hear the logical voice.
Often, I don't know why neurotypicals worry about the things that they do, It makes no sense to me. I might be able to guess the thinking involved, but often I find their focus on things that they cannot control, or things that have already happened, absolutely strange.
As for the things that you list, when those events come to pass, you'll deal with it because you have to. There isn't a choice, but you can't pre-deal with it. As far as I know, it doesn't work that way. As for everyone else in your life, you can worry about them, but they are going to do what they will, and things will happen as they are going to. You can help and support them when they need it, but worry isn't going to change things.
Thank you Athena. I really appreciate those thoughts.
hehehe! Make me laugh harder than this:
Athena writes: "It makes no sense to me"!!! OMG!! I am dying laughing so hard!!
TY
Best wishes for a pleasant day and great year ahead. See you!
Hi Tim,
Best wishes to you too. Happy New Year !
Happy New Year, Athena!
I have a couple of questions for you. From your writing, it seems your childhood was stable, with patient, loving, and decent parents. I recall you mentioning a time when you found yourself in a bit of trouble, which led to your diagnosis, but it seems your intellect helped you avoid deeper pitfalls and develop cognitive empathy.
To what extent do you credit your childhood for your successful adjustment? Or do you think your high stress tolerance would have made it less relevant? Lastly, do you believe the discipline of ballet played a key role in keeping you busy and out of trouble?
Wishing you a year filled with joy, growth, and wonderful adventures!
Thank you, Jennifer, the same to you and yours.
I will write a post about the importance of upbringing in psychopathy that addresses those questions.
Thank you, Athena. I look forward to reading your thoughts on these topics.
A suggestion for a post. Your thoughts on why high profile professionals in the mental health field, some of them with impressive credentials, get Psychopathy so wrong. Many associate Psychopathy and Narcissism, mixing up the characteristics of the two. Jordan Peterson has done this a few times as has Dr Todd Grande. You have often referred to Dr Hare being responsible for propagating much of the misunderstanding, but I would have expected better of other professionals who have considerable experience.
I will do a post on this. Unfortunately, not being in that profession, I am not privy to much of what goes on, I have only heard anecdotally about the problems. I can speculate, but I may be wrong in my thoughts
It's not my favourite time of the year. I already have anxiety and the holiday season just makes it worse. All I do is worry and mull over the past and the future. I can't wait for things to get back to normal.
I thought about a post on things about neurotypicals that you still don't understand. And I also have two questions:
- Are we getting more posts on the Human Darkness series?
- How do you fight the boredom/keep yourself busy? I'm sure boredom is a much bigger problem for you but I'm starting to run out of hobbies and could use some tips.
Happy New Year to everyone!
Yes, there are more coming. I just thought that there should be a break for the holidays. As you mentioned, there can be a lot of negative emotions attached to this time of year, so I decided not to add to it.
I can write a post on boredom if you would like.
Oh yes please, that'd be great. Thank you.
I can see why it doesn't take the human made creation of a new year to start making fresh positive beginnings. Still, purely out of conditioning/habit, it's definitely when I tend to think the most about it. Hoping it's a reasonably good 2025 for you Athena (I don't imagine you're too bothered about hearing "Happy new year" so I won't say that). Did you tend to have any thoughts at all on any future life goals for yourself towards the end of 2024 or this week? Or weren't you bothered?
I would definitely still be interested to see an article on why you see there's no such as a narcissistic sociopath (although if you've already covered this somewhere I'm not recalling please don't hesitate to say).
Also on this: "This is one of the places that psychopaths and neurotypicals differ, and it becomes a glaring difference every year."
I'd definitely be interested to hear more from you on why it's the glaring difference for you that it is. One thing I have to question is if this might have anything to do with possibly living in the present moment more than neurotypicals.
Mostly, that it matters to anyone at all, for any reason. For me, it's a day, like any other, that requires a change regarding remembering the date has gone up by one. That's it.
In contrast, a lot of people see the New Year as a time for personal promises, reflections, sadness, hope, etc. I don't get that, and I don't get drinking into oblivion because the year rolled over.
My community really takes to party hardy on both Christmas and New Years.
Today as I walked my dog, MANY parties still raged though the sun was long up.
But somehow, there was no restaurant open!! A sign (at my usual place) said open and I went inside.. but only "family". Having made it inside, I though they might at least feed me, or give my dog some water, but...nooo!
Of the coming year, I want to come along on the ride: Be your free and true self to explore where you will. Best wishes to you and all who follow you here.
Thank you, Tim.
You as well
Happy new year to you too Athena.On religion and politics,you could write about that
I don't discuss politics. It is a hard and fast rule of mine. People cannot keep their emotions out of it.
As for religion, you would need to be more specific. I don't adhere to any religion myself, but understand the purpose of it for many people, however. I don't spend much time in reading or learning about different religions anymore. I did a long time ago, but most of that information is lost in the ether.
Are you than agnostic,atheist or a mix of both?
I know that there is more than this understanding of existence. That much I have seen, but I don't know beyond that. I am fine with not knowing. I know there is more, but what that more is, I have no idea.
Ok