Since you asked in your post, if I was in a similar conversation, upon reading the death threat my response would be "okay we're done here" then I would have blocked him. My emotional response would be to feel disrespected, but only mildly since it's online.
My response to seeing it happen to you is annoyance. His book sounds like it's going to be the equivalent of a Jewish culture book written by a Nazi. There are so many books out there written about certain groups of people, by people who neither are apart of nor respect that particular community.
One thing to keep in mind about emotional language is that the emotional response is near instantaneous. There is no thinking, "who's this person, and should I care?" before the response happens. People can of course choose to dwell on those emotions, but an emotional response in and of itself doesn't indicate that someone cares about that person's opinion.
Negative emotional responses can be thought of as pain. If a stranger were to run up to you and stomp you on the foot, would it not hurt because they're a stranger? What if they're a child, or an athlete, or an inanimate rock? The athlete's stomp will hurt more than the child's stomp, and a rock will hurt more or less depending on the mass and speed of the rock when it hits your foot, but unless the thing your hit with is as light as a feather, you'll still feel something.
Personally I did felt annoyed at first but then amused to the end. His response, however, reminded me of times I was bullied. When I showed nonchalance and looked strong, people started to yell at me, make rumors about me being psychopathic, tell me how much they hated me, etc.
It was projection he did at the end, but your perspective provides a new view. I would have ended the convo simply because it was a waste of time but then seeing your quote, "Why should you care? How important is this person?" Has placed some gems on this website. I don't know if you watch game of throne but ut reminds me of the quote that power and status is like a shadow on the wall. Ever changing and only legit if the person approves. Your post made me think of how many people we unnecessarily give power to because they try to force hierarchy by interacting with us through condescension and insults. Turns out that most of us are pretty much nobodies unless someone agrees. Plus not every open mouth should be listened to and we have that choice.
"Why should I care?" So simple yet we forget all the time.
I didn’t like reading the interaction. If it was a similar interaction for example on a blog but with two non psychopaths it would make me very uncomfortable. I would find it extremely difficult not to step in to defend the person I viewed as being provoked.
Given that the person being provoked here happens to be a psychopath, this lessens my need to defend. This isn’t because I view psychopaths as being undeserving of protection. It’s more that I am confident that the psychopath has the mental agility to respond effectively to the provocation and I am also confident that the psychopath is unaffected by the provocation. Essentially, not getting upset. All is still not well with me though because there still remains the matter of respect. I would view it as Athena taking time to review questions, answering honestly, considering the question and her response to it etc. I view this as deserving of both courtesy and respect. Both elements were lacking in the interaction on the side of the commenter. To excuse the behaviour as being some kind of test is a blame shift for the provocation, it’s condescending and it’s very basic in terms of a manipulation. That irritates me too if I’m honest.
I’m big on respect. If people take the time to answer questions thoughtfully as demonstrably Athena does, then that deserves respect in my book. People don’t have to agree or even like what they read, but they ought to respect the time that goes in.
When I see arguments break out online between commenters I know well (online) I find it difficult not to try to diffuse and restore harmony. Yes, that’s a me thing I know. I am learning to stay out, not because I don’t want to protect or defend but rather I have come to realise that often these arguments break out due to crossed lines of communication / misinterpretation of the meaning behind a comment. That gets resolved more quickly if I stay out rather than wade in, despite my intentions to broker resolution being genuine.
I don’t lose my temper online. Lose your temper, lose the argument. If I had been in Athena’s shoes I would likely have closed the guy down sooner. Interact with me honestly, in a genuine way or don’t bother. I have no desire to win, but I also don’t suffer fools or disrespect online.
“Cool” did make me smile. It was likely genuine, but it’s also a clever move.
His interactions with me were rather tepid compared to many others that I get. I will shut someone down quickly if I find them to be intentionally mean-spirited, but this was simply a conversation that the ulterior motives didn't matter to me.
Yes, I’ve seen some really nasty comments thrown in your direction on Quora. I understand we all have different limits as to where we will draw the line and close someone down. Mine is probably quite a low threshold!
When it’s myself, I actually find it easier to disengage from the conversation and I do look at it from the standpoint of, “Do I value the opinion of this person?” and furthermore, “Do I value their opinion of me?”
I get far more riled up watching someone else being provoked. It pushes different buttons for me.
It might be because with ourselves we know exactly how well or badly we are taking it, it is in our control, but with someone outside us we can be kinda... On the safe side of better be protective than underestimate the effect. Take control of a disruptive situation. Could be some projected sensitivity. Plus it fosters standard we could rely on in future - that there are people who will come to aid if there is need.
And heroic role feels nice too. Yeah, there is something of a boost to one's sens eof self in coming to aid.
For me it depends on how I read the person that is targeted - if they are ok, as you assured your friend, then they are ok. But when I saw my roomie being let down by a response to her affectionate gesture, I went into active mode.
Of course other people might have other views on what'đ going on in such situation.
Oh yeah. I may not be a psychopath, but I definitely do have a policy that all interactions with me happen either on terms acceptable to me, or not at all.
I had all the neurotypical responses - to protect, defend, a bit of anger....well, actually, I'm still a bit annoyed by that guy - was all that really necessary to come to his diagnosis? Maybe it was.
It looks like Athena "won" the discussion, but it probably isn't like that either. I'm guessing it was just "well, that was fun while it lasted" and then on to a video game or dinner.
Ah, I wish I could have a hybrid version of psychopathic and neurotypical wiring, be able to switch between the types when I required :)
Our psychologist told me that people with ADHD are quite good at compartmentalising.
I don't have ADHD though, my husband and kids do - I'm terrible at it, lol.
Also, I must thank you for this article, Athena.
After I read it, I read it to my husband, who then asked me to screenshot parts of it to help him and the kids. He was blown away by the pizza comment :)
I think I may actually have something like that. There have been situations where I was attacked physically and needed to be totally focused on surveying the situation, looking for an opportunity and taking it in order to ensure my personal safety, and yeah. A switch flipped, and it was like I had no emotions at all. No pain (even though, as it turned out, I'd been physically injured during the attack), no fear, not even any anger. Just... nothing except total focus. It was like time stood still for me. And then I saw my opportunity and... took it.
I mean, I'm not 100% neurotypical even when that switch hasn't been flipped (after all, I do have Asperger's syndrome), but still: I am able to feel emotions, to get really angry or (as I am actually doing now) to cry over my cat who just walked over the Rainbow Bridge a couple of days ago after living with me for nearly 16 years. May my Marcel rest in peace, and may God bless his memory...
Loss of a beloved pet is excruciating. We often spend more time with our pets than we do with our extended family. It’s just awful when they go, it’s the loss of unconditional love.
To be so upset, Marcel was clearly loved. A lucky boy :)
Well, I did the best I could to give him a long, happy and healthy life. It is probably a miracle he lived as long as he did, given he had by that time spent half his life fighting with a variety of ailments... I comfort myself that now he can spend his eternity in a wonderful palace in heaven, where he can enjoy perfect health and do all of the things he was no longer able to do as his life drew to its close. He was the most impartially loving creature I have ever met. I hope I can honor his memory by following his example...
It sounds like you did all you could do. I like the idea of pulling a personal positive out of the loss. It’s an optimistic way of looking at challenging life events.
Yes, I experienced that too when I was attacked -- the focus goes immediately to survival and how to achieve that. (Clearly I did, since I'm writing this here.) Emotions came in afterwards. Although curiously enough, I was shaking during the experience. Probably the intense adrenaline. Just didn't feel any emotions associated with the shaking.
So glad to see that you survived :) I didn't shake, but I was probably 3 times stronger than usual. No doubt intense adrenale :) I needed to be that strong, though, given I was dealing with an assailant who outweighed me by over 50%.
Luckily I didn't need to be especially strong. Mostly smart -- as in think through what can I say that will show I am not a threat. (Ie, I was extremely myopic without my glasses; could not identify him; that worked. Of course, he may not have been intending to kill me afterwards anyway. There's no way to know.)
I read some things that you wrote about your two cats on Quora. I assume one was Marcel. I was amazed by the behaviour you described in them while you were ill. Their compassion and understanding were astonishing to me, and the friendship we can have with our feline loved ones is incomparable and unique. How lucky Marcel was to die in your arms after a well lived and well loved life. Still, I understand your profound loss, and wish you well.
Thank you for your kind words. Lalcia and I do miss him for sure. You are right: Marcel was the gentleman in the elegant tabby-and-white tuxedo. He was always very human and impartially loving to everyone. Not just me. Even our friend who had a psychotic break, got evicted with nowhere to go, and ended up at our place, looking visibly disturbed, so that he and Lalcia could have been forgiven for being afraid of her. But no... they slept on her and kept her warm all night so that she could sleep peacefully.
We did have to have a tough discussion at the end of his life, and this is how I laid my thoughts out for him: "I've been praying for a miracle for you, for you to live a few more years and be able to enjoy the 'new me' as I have striven to finally be a truly good Little Laddy for you. As long as you want to keep fighting, I'll fight with you. If, on the other hand, you feel you really need to go, you can go. Whenever that moment comes, I hope that you will be able to die peacefully in my arms. I would prefer not to get Dr. Marcin involved, because I don't want to feel like I'm playing God with your life."
And indeed: he fought to the very last. He used his last shreds of strength to do such things as make the once easy but now long and arduous trek from the bathroom to the living room, and then climb up on the sofa to be with me. Or when that left him totally exhausted, drag himself a few centimeters toward me from his little carrier, to show that he wanted me to help him come up on the couch with me again.
Or when even that was too much, use literally his last strength to turn himself around in there so he could at least see me as he reclined in comfort and spent his last hours there, and then waited for me to finish my usual Tuesday night conversation with my mom and prepare his dinner, making it as easy as possible for him to consume, only to find that he was too weak now to eat...
So I just held him, rubbed his ribs and tickled his ears and tummy, thinking maybe he just needed to gather his strength, but within no more half an hour, he went to meet his Maker...
I was able to arrange a wonderful funeral for him within 12 hours of his death, and his body is now resting in a beautiful place. I believe he laid up such treasures in heaven for himself while he sojourned here on this earth that he now has an amazing palace to live in for eternity.
We had the kind of friendship that I will probably cry when I think about him for the rest of my life, just as I cry about Argie, my beloved childhood doggie, even nearly 50 years since his passing. He was probably as loving as Marcel was, so I bet he has a beautiful palace to live in too... I am looking forward to seeing them and all the other animals that have been in my life over the years when it is my time to take leave of this earth.
Thank you for sharing such a touching and heartwarming story about Marcel. He was clearly a special cat with a loving and compassionate nature that even extended towards those who were struggling. Most animals, I would imagine, would shy away. Marcel had remarkable karma, and innate goodness. It's inspiring that you were there for him in his final moments, and how you were able to provide him with such a peaceful and dignified passing. I'm sure he knew how much you loved him and appreciated everything you did for him. I'm also glad to hear that you were able to give him a beautiful funeral and that his body is resting in a special place. It's clear that he left a lasting impact on your life and that he will be remembered with love and fondness. I've had cats all of my life, and currently have a boy who is also a very special gentleman. I hope he will emulate Marcel's goodness and live his life just as well and as long. Thank you again for sharing.
You are most welcome. I was unfortunately not able to have a kitty of my own as a child, due to allergies of a family member. While I did later live in a few households with housemates who had cats, Marcel was my first kitty of my very own. We met when he was perhaps 3 months old and living outside, and he moved in with me 3 months later. So he spent almost his entire life with me. Lalcia and I, and I am sure Marcel as well, wish you and your special gentleman many long years of health and happiness together :)
"Um, just in case we’re unclear, I’d gladly put a 9mm round in your face, just as I would any rabid animal to put it out of its misery, so, you know, don’t think I actually like you as a person."
I think what I might have done would be to say, "Hmm... I'm not miserable and it's not catching. So there's no need for that 9-mm round." But to be on the safe side, I probably would have reported him to the authorities.
Where I live, it is a criminal offense to threaten people. I agree with this. And reporting it is probably the best thing to do in that particular legal environment, because it is essentially impossible to avoid serving prison time if you kill someone, even if it was in self-defense. The only difference is that you'll serve 7 years instead of 25.
But then again... it is nearly impossible for civilians to have firearms here. You can have them for hunting or sports purposes, but there are very strict rules about registration, training and storage that must be complied with in order to have a firearm. It is probably impossible to own or otherwise possess such a weapon without the authorities being aware of it.
Still... he should not be allowed to just threaten people with impunity. This is not conducive to a safe and harmonious environment for all. He's not doing his fair share of the work to make that happen.
Words inherently have an emotionality to them; yes they might just be 'words' but copy writers and marketing exist because they know the words you use and how you use them has an impact whether you want them to or not.
I assume it's the same for a psychopath too, just not in the same way. I.e. you see a food described in a certain way, or people talking about how good this certain food is, etc. Which I guess may make you want to also try it? (Is that true for you?)
For me when I saw the word "HA!" I felt both an accusatory finger pointing at me, as well as his delight. Then with the gun death threat, I just felt "bruh he's lost the plot"...
How do you not care what someone says when it's hit your heart before you had the chance to cognitively disregard it as worthless?
I don't have the inclination to try something based on someone's description of it. It's interesting, but advertisement is totally wasted on me. Nothing about the words, the visuals, the enticement has any effect on me. I find it all to be noise and a waste of time.
I wanted to add to this comment because advertising works because social association, relationships, kinship, authority and hierarchy work with neurotypical people. I claim such things are essential to building societies, which the psychopath is mostly "blind" to, except as an external mechanism to observe and exploit like physics. This is liable to produce enemies, and one day one of the smarter ones will get his wish, even if the psychopath had no malevolent intentions :(. Fortunately there are places where psychopaths are "useful" and when assigned those roles, they become an asset to societies.
The unique situation that Athena has, for example, will only work if there are people that care enough about her to facilitate her survival.
Athena, I understand that your parents were exceptionally patient and understanding and played such a role in your life. It is remarkable to hear these exchanges, and I wish I could leverage more of this. I think that the way to translate what you are imparting to neurotypicals (let alone empaths like me!) is to, as you are doing, speak in terms of boundaries. And to me this way of putting it brings considerable profit.
I somehow still wish I could enhance your boundary descriptions with language that discriminates the feeling dimensions from the factual ones, which are, for neurotypicals, just two types of "factual" dimensions (because the feelings connected with relationships, exchanges, and behaviors do in fact amont to pertinent facts in the progress of the group affected at large).
"I somehow still wish I could enhance your boundary descriptions with language that discriminates the feeling dimensions from the factual ones"
Are you able to elaborate on this a bit so I can understand what it is that you would like? It seems like it could be interesting, but I am not certain that I am clear about exactly what you mean.
Hi Athena, I had a while to think about your inquiry and it's really hard for me to express the categories right. (By the way, It was perhaps equally moving to read your account the second time, because I wanted to see how to best answer, and paid close attention to your line of reasoning concerning responses to abuse or threats).
Something I said at a meeting recently is that there are people who are more focused on reality, and others on appearances, because perception is important to neurotypical people. Now on the one hand, I tell people that, for me, truth is an absolute value, come to me what may, but on the other hand, I respond strongly emotionally to human interaction in many circumstances, including often online.
But when others are expressing something with the purpose of trying to get a response, it takes understanding that fact -as such- that this is the context to understand their behavior in.
But there are also other scenarios where strong feelings and unconcious behavior result. For example, when dealing with dominant individuals who are using being in command in social situations, their behavior causes group dynamics as such. Most people choose to go along because it is expedient, while a minority will respond constructively or also defiantly instead. now describing the boundaries in play with such situations would be of extreme importants for people who want to understand more sophisticated bullying styles, and also politics in groups.
So are we talking about social dynamics being scripted by conscious and/or unconscious intent (emotional or otherwise) by those that are in positions or power or focus?
9mm to the face doesn't bother me at all. I would tell him what happened the last time someone put a 9mm in my face. I made the guy pay me so I didn't take his gun from him and use it on him. Psychopathy in a high stress situation is like a superpower. Since, you have no stress or fear you stay calm, cool, and collected and figure out how to take control of the situation with confidence and charm.
This reminds me of an incident I heard about back in my Society for Creative Anachronism days. A couple of friends were returning from a feast in full garb, including swords strapped to their waists. And some guy pulled a switchblade on them, saying, "Here's 6" of steel saying that you're going to give me your wallets." They just pulled out their (live!) swords and said, "We'll up you 30 inches. Lay your wallet and your watch on the ground in front of us and get the f*** out of here." He realized he didn't really have any choice, so he complied...
PS For some reason, I am not able to reply directly to your condolences concerning the departure of my Marcel, so let me thank you here and mention that he was a very good boy. He was friendly and kind to everyone. I remember in particular one time when a friend had a psychotic break and got evicted from her apartment with nowhere to go, so she ended up at our place looking visibly disturbed. He could have been forgiven for being afraid of her. But he wasn't. He and my other kitty spent the night keeping her warm and ensuring she had a peaceful sleep. He was so impartial in his kindness that it made no difference, for example, whether he had any reasonable expectation of getting fed by the person in question. I hope I can honor his memory by following his worthy example :)
I have noticed some weirdness in the comments section as well, and found that on the main page with the entire comment tree there is not a reply option, but going to the comment itself directly from the email link that only has that person's comment displayed, there I can find the reply. I don't know why that is at the moment, and hopefully Substack fixes it.
Well, it seems you have found a workaround. And now that I was scrolling through all of the comments, I saw the reply button for your original comment.
Yes, he was awesome. Even at the very end of his life, weak as he was, he took the attitude that as long as love is there - and he meant by that a good deal more than just feelings, it definitely meant actions too - it's all good. And when the time came, he died peacefully in my arms with no need for assistance from his doctor. In that we all have to die sooner or later, the manner of his passing was probably the best anyone could have hoped for. And thanks to a bit of help from an old friend of ours, he's resting in a beautiful place now. I'm glad we were able to give him such a worthy and dignified send-off.
At first, I agreed with you. As long as the jackass was entertaining, what difference does it make what he says? But, like you, I am anonymous online, so people like that don't usually bother me unless they're misleading other people. Then, I might challenge them, or ask for evidence for what they're saying.
But, after much thought, and with the realization that most people have public identities online, I consider the death threat, no matter the motive or even if in jest, should result in the guy being immediately banned. He could have simply said that he did not like you. I think he was trying to get some reaction, and didn't have any real desire to kill you. But my objection to this kind of language is from a desire for there to be some degree of civility in online communication. That sort of talk, and far worse, has terrorized a lot of public figures, and their families, and it should result in a ban, or even criminal charges, and mental health checks.
To me that death threat was transparent like freshly washed glass, so I chuckled. This transcript was entertaining and I found myself appreciating the... Not sure if to call it sparring because he sure was striking, but against a block of titanium, so no fight on the other side, except maybe in figuring out what is the aim of Mr User.
Now if I am dealing with an actual conflict, here's what plays a role - do I think they are acting the way they are because I upset them (and it's not the sort "well, facts")? Then I feel bad. Do I think they have a point? I feel bad, I wonder how hard will be rectifying, if I can integrate their point with what seems like I shouldn't discard (or plain it hurts to discard (because both can happen - there is valid aspect to the issue, or I am just too invested in something or both at once)), worry whether there is something wrong with my cognition and direction that I did not recognize this sooner (I know, that's why we exchange opinions, to broaden our visions, but sometimes it is not ignorance, but something like colour-blindness or some such issue). Also sense of responsibility and feeling sure I did all in my power to improve whatever problem arose. Because not wanting to be that bystander that could have done something and did nothing. In case I am sure I did my part and the rest is on the other party, I might still actually worry about where is my world headed and how it could impact me and what I care about in long run or what it proves about people, civilization, stuff. And the last thing - if I think the person is serious, how likely they are to really endanger me.
Which doesn't mean I stress over every dissatisfaction and critticism and goading into fight. Depends on how big it is. And perhaps on whether I am already stewing in something and this conflict seems related to it. I can experience also joy of being victorious in handling things to my satisfaction. I can also deem soemthing to be totally over nothing and of zero impact and just rise my eyebrows or not even that.
Last time I got offended was when I showed my father a drawing which featured a weapon design and his reaction was "you don't know much about that stuff, do you?" because I do know more than him, I am the one who lowkey is into historical weaponry and spent months watching vids on history, combat and weaponry. I was angry that I didn't have as much to show for it as to not induce that reaction and I was angry that one of issues he pointed out was something I literally recalled seeing explored in one such video, but forgot to take into consideration. When we discussed what's wrong with the drawing and I pointed out that the original objection he haf was moot, because he misunderstood the drawing a bit, I felt already better, but the fact that it was still a bit less stable than a pretty obvious third option and it was that very thing I saw and didn't recall, that still burned a bit, but it was already milder and actually moving cosntructively. I also felt very ridiculous for how strong was my initial reaction. The thing also was that I was inda figuring along the way how to make it look while I was drawing so that too, but that is a mistake in itself. And the fact that my knowledge is theoretical, while he has practical experience with physical mechanics of tools and that is a real weak spot on my part, that certainly added to the whole sense of humiliation and need to defend myself. And I deeply appreciate constructive critticism, but this took me off guard in quite a way. Great source of annoyance can be, when I feel like I do not have a way to prove how things are and I am feeling sure that I would be seen like making up the explanation.
On the matter of defending one'đ honor, I think there might be some generational ingrained model for that, because it was often required that the isulted accused party does not shrug it off, but meets the challenge and proves they are not to be trifled with. If they ignored it, they might have seriously hurt their reputation within their community. So that could perhaps play into tendency to get all reactive. Of course, there are ways to meet the challenge and one can meet the challenge without actually feeling strongly about it.
I'd say when it comes to insults etc. a fairly good brake on emotional overreaction could be notion that that is exactly what the attacker wants. Oneđ' defense and self-prservation is not getting riled up and seeing it for something we should not let us hurt.
Very good explanation about "why even care". I care about opinions that gives me people whom I value on intellectual and emotional level. Lately I had one "friend" , who came of really rational, but deep down was so sensitive. I realise to better cut off friendship because I was hurting his feelings. He started to act so bothered and defensive, when i said my opinion about him or random things.
Not only by those in power, but by all participants, who have various "playbooks", most of which are to minimize inconvenience and maximize prosperity and standing/respect from the group
Hmmm.... I responded precisely as you did and gawked in non comprehension at the other comments here.
It also reminds me of real discussions I have had. People try to start on me. Like guys try to get difficult. And when they do because they don't get a fear response they kind of deflate. Mostly what happens is they will say something that is meant to be provocative but I respond to it in a factual manner, and I will just give them more information. Also, I remember a homeless guy associated with a church tried to get me to pity him and I just responded normally (so like a normal conversation - not including emotional manipulation), and a friend of mine at the time thought this was hysterical saying that this guy had tried his Trump card on me. Trying to get me to pity him, and it had fallen flat.
The idea though of responding to endless hypotheticals is not one I agree with. Because I have often thought unless the hypothetical is at least somewhat related to real life, there might be a very good reason said hypothetical cannot happen. But you can throw a knife. I used to do it clear across my room and into the wall.
I have had very similar experiences, and it is always super interesting to see them double down and try harder for that pity response. When it falls flat they realize that they have nothing left in their playbook.
Well... they don't try harder with me. They really realise quite deeply I'm not going to get it - the response I give is so matter of fact and outside the norm. I do understand subtext and hinting and all that but unless there is a compelling emotional reason to pretend to respond to it, I will not. I have actually got better at it. Sometimes a hug will suffice. It only takes a few seconds.
What I find most interesting about these interactions... and I suppose I am uncomfortably moving away from my image of myself when I was more highly stressed. Is that, with the pity plays that are very intelligent and strategic, once the wool is pulled over an NT's eyes, or even worse someone more vulnerable than an NT. They will not see it not matter what. It is like the NT does the doubling down for the ... what is often the narc.
The allergy to seeing the manipulator as anything other than an angelic victim is utterly illogical. Because considering that the person is not a genuine victim does not actually detract from enabling them while it is still only considered as an abstract.
Given the context, I was mostly amused by those exchanges -- although that death threat was certainly startling. However, if it had been a personal (and neurotypical) friend who was the "target" of this person's curiosity, I believe I would have felt indignant and protective. What I might have *done* about that, dunno. I've learned the hard way not to jump on my white horse and ride to the rescue. (LOL)
The whole "why should I care what this person thinks" is stellar. I find it a tad harder to let go of caring what someone else *does*, especially actions aimed towards me. I do have a motto though, when I can remember it: namely WWAD = What Would Athena Do? (LOL) When I can remember that, it does help me uncouple from some situations. (Thanks, Athena!)
Since you asked in your post, if I was in a similar conversation, upon reading the death threat my response would be "okay we're done here" then I would have blocked him. My emotional response would be to feel disrespected, but only mildly since it's online.
My response to seeing it happen to you is annoyance. His book sounds like it's going to be the equivalent of a Jewish culture book written by a Nazi. There are so many books out there written about certain groups of people, by people who neither are apart of nor respect that particular community.
One thing to keep in mind about emotional language is that the emotional response is near instantaneous. There is no thinking, "who's this person, and should I care?" before the response happens. People can of course choose to dwell on those emotions, but an emotional response in and of itself doesn't indicate that someone cares about that person's opinion.
Negative emotional responses can be thought of as pain. If a stranger were to run up to you and stomp you on the foot, would it not hurt because they're a stranger? What if they're a child, or an athlete, or an inanimate rock? The athlete's stomp will hurt more than the child's stomp, and a rock will hurt more or less depending on the mass and speed of the rock when it hits your foot, but unless the thing your hit with is as light as a feather, you'll still feel something.
The emotional responses to negative emotions is always interesting to me as that is a foreign concept to me. I look for intention and context.
"His book sounds like it's going to be the equivalent of a Jewish culture book written by a Nazi."
OMG [The great-grandmother of all facepalms]
Personally I did felt annoyed at first but then amused to the end. His response, however, reminded me of times I was bullied. When I showed nonchalance and looked strong, people started to yell at me, make rumors about me being psychopathic, tell me how much they hated me, etc.
It was projection he did at the end, but your perspective provides a new view. I would have ended the convo simply because it was a waste of time but then seeing your quote, "Why should you care? How important is this person?" Has placed some gems on this website. I don't know if you watch game of throne but ut reminds me of the quote that power and status is like a shadow on the wall. Ever changing and only legit if the person approves. Your post made me think of how many people we unnecessarily give power to because they try to force hierarchy by interacting with us through condescension and insults. Turns out that most of us are pretty much nobodies unless someone agrees. Plus not every open mouth should be listened to and we have that choice.
"Why should I care?" So simple yet we forget all the time.
Agreed
I didn’t like reading the interaction. If it was a similar interaction for example on a blog but with two non psychopaths it would make me very uncomfortable. I would find it extremely difficult not to step in to defend the person I viewed as being provoked.
Given that the person being provoked here happens to be a psychopath, this lessens my need to defend. This isn’t because I view psychopaths as being undeserving of protection. It’s more that I am confident that the psychopath has the mental agility to respond effectively to the provocation and I am also confident that the psychopath is unaffected by the provocation. Essentially, not getting upset. All is still not well with me though because there still remains the matter of respect. I would view it as Athena taking time to review questions, answering honestly, considering the question and her response to it etc. I view this as deserving of both courtesy and respect. Both elements were lacking in the interaction on the side of the commenter. To excuse the behaviour as being some kind of test is a blame shift for the provocation, it’s condescending and it’s very basic in terms of a manipulation. That irritates me too if I’m honest.
I’m big on respect. If people take the time to answer questions thoughtfully as demonstrably Athena does, then that deserves respect in my book. People don’t have to agree or even like what they read, but they ought to respect the time that goes in.
When I see arguments break out online between commenters I know well (online) I find it difficult not to try to diffuse and restore harmony. Yes, that’s a me thing I know. I am learning to stay out, not because I don’t want to protect or defend but rather I have come to realise that often these arguments break out due to crossed lines of communication / misinterpretation of the meaning behind a comment. That gets resolved more quickly if I stay out rather than wade in, despite my intentions to broker resolution being genuine.
I don’t lose my temper online. Lose your temper, lose the argument. If I had been in Athena’s shoes I would likely have closed the guy down sooner. Interact with me honestly, in a genuine way or don’t bother. I have no desire to win, but I also don’t suffer fools or disrespect online.
“Cool” did make me smile. It was likely genuine, but it’s also a clever move.
His interactions with me were rather tepid compared to many others that I get. I will shut someone down quickly if I find them to be intentionally mean-spirited, but this was simply a conversation that the ulterior motives didn't matter to me.
Yes, I’ve seen some really nasty comments thrown in your direction on Quora. I understand we all have different limits as to where we will draw the line and close someone down. Mine is probably quite a low threshold!
When it’s myself, I actually find it easier to disengage from the conversation and I do look at it from the standpoint of, “Do I value the opinion of this person?” and furthermore, “Do I value their opinion of me?”
I get far more riled up watching someone else being provoked. It pushes different buttons for me.
That's interesting
It might be because with ourselves we know exactly how well or badly we are taking it, it is in our control, but with someone outside us we can be kinda... On the safe side of better be protective than underestimate the effect. Take control of a disruptive situation. Could be some projected sensitivity. Plus it fosters standard we could rely on in future - that there are people who will come to aid if there is need.
And heroic role feels nice too. Yeah, there is something of a boost to one's sens eof self in coming to aid.
For me it depends on how I read the person that is targeted - if they are ok, as you assured your friend, then they are ok. But when I saw my roomie being let down by a response to her affectionate gesture, I went into active mode.
Of course other people might have other views on what'đ going on in such situation.
Oh yeah. I may not be a psychopath, but I definitely do have a policy that all interactions with me happen either on terms acceptable to me, or not at all.
This was fun to read.
I had all the neurotypical responses - to protect, defend, a bit of anger....well, actually, I'm still a bit annoyed by that guy - was all that really necessary to come to his diagnosis? Maybe it was.
It looks like Athena "won" the discussion, but it probably isn't like that either. I'm guessing it was just "well, that was fun while it lasted" and then on to a video game or dinner.
Ah, I wish I could have a hybrid version of psychopathic and neurotypical wiring, be able to switch between the types when I required :)
That would be interesting. I think that compartmentalization is something like that, but I could be misunderstanding how it works.
Our psychologist told me that people with ADHD are quite good at compartmentalising.
I don't have ADHD though, my husband and kids do - I'm terrible at it, lol.
Also, I must thank you for this article, Athena.
After I read it, I read it to my husband, who then asked me to screenshot parts of it to help him and the kids. He was blown away by the pizza comment :)
I am glad that my perspective is helpful to you both
I think I may actually have something like that. There have been situations where I was attacked physically and needed to be totally focused on surveying the situation, looking for an opportunity and taking it in order to ensure my personal safety, and yeah. A switch flipped, and it was like I had no emotions at all. No pain (even though, as it turned out, I'd been physically injured during the attack), no fear, not even any anger. Just... nothing except total focus. It was like time stood still for me. And then I saw my opportunity and... took it.
I mean, I'm not 100% neurotypical even when that switch hasn't been flipped (after all, I do have Asperger's syndrome), but still: I am able to feel emotions, to get really angry or (as I am actually doing now) to cry over my cat who just walked over the Rainbow Bridge a couple of days ago after living with me for nearly 16 years. May my Marcel rest in peace, and may God bless his memory...
My condolences for your loss.
I only just read this comment Karol.
Loss of a beloved pet is excruciating. We often spend more time with our pets than we do with our extended family. It’s just awful when they go, it’s the loss of unconditional love.
To be so upset, Marcel was clearly loved. A lucky boy :)
Well, I did the best I could to give him a long, happy and healthy life. It is probably a miracle he lived as long as he did, given he had by that time spent half his life fighting with a variety of ailments... I comfort myself that now he can spend his eternity in a wonderful palace in heaven, where he can enjoy perfect health and do all of the things he was no longer able to do as his life drew to its close. He was the most impartially loving creature I have ever met. I hope I can honor his memory by following his example...
It sounds like you did all you could do. I like the idea of pulling a personal positive out of the loss. It’s an optimistic way of looking at challenging life events.
Yes, I experienced that too when I was attacked -- the focus goes immediately to survival and how to achieve that. (Clearly I did, since I'm writing this here.) Emotions came in afterwards. Although curiously enough, I was shaking during the experience. Probably the intense adrenaline. Just didn't feel any emotions associated with the shaking.
So glad to see that you survived :) I didn't shake, but I was probably 3 times stronger than usual. No doubt intense adrenale :) I needed to be that strong, though, given I was dealing with an assailant who outweighed me by over 50%.
Glad you survived too! Yay us!
Luckily I didn't need to be especially strong. Mostly smart -- as in think through what can I say that will show I am not a threat. (Ie, I was extremely myopic without my glasses; could not identify him; that worked. Of course, he may not have been intending to kill me afterwards anyway. There's no way to know.)
Regardless of the situation, ultimately the only real weapon anyone has is the one between their ears :)
Ah yes, so true!
I read some things that you wrote about your two cats on Quora. I assume one was Marcel. I was amazed by the behaviour you described in them while you were ill. Their compassion and understanding were astonishing to me, and the friendship we can have with our feline loved ones is incomparable and unique. How lucky Marcel was to die in your arms after a well lived and well loved life. Still, I understand your profound loss, and wish you well.
Thank you for your kind words. Lalcia and I do miss him for sure. You are right: Marcel was the gentleman in the elegant tabby-and-white tuxedo. He was always very human and impartially loving to everyone. Not just me. Even our friend who had a psychotic break, got evicted with nowhere to go, and ended up at our place, looking visibly disturbed, so that he and Lalcia could have been forgiven for being afraid of her. But no... they slept on her and kept her warm all night so that she could sleep peacefully.
We did have to have a tough discussion at the end of his life, and this is how I laid my thoughts out for him: "I've been praying for a miracle for you, for you to live a few more years and be able to enjoy the 'new me' as I have striven to finally be a truly good Little Laddy for you. As long as you want to keep fighting, I'll fight with you. If, on the other hand, you feel you really need to go, you can go. Whenever that moment comes, I hope that you will be able to die peacefully in my arms. I would prefer not to get Dr. Marcin involved, because I don't want to feel like I'm playing God with your life."
And indeed: he fought to the very last. He used his last shreds of strength to do such things as make the once easy but now long and arduous trek from the bathroom to the living room, and then climb up on the sofa to be with me. Or when that left him totally exhausted, drag himself a few centimeters toward me from his little carrier, to show that he wanted me to help him come up on the couch with me again.
Or when even that was too much, use literally his last strength to turn himself around in there so he could at least see me as he reclined in comfort and spent his last hours there, and then waited for me to finish my usual Tuesday night conversation with my mom and prepare his dinner, making it as easy as possible for him to consume, only to find that he was too weak now to eat...
So I just held him, rubbed his ribs and tickled his ears and tummy, thinking maybe he just needed to gather his strength, but within no more half an hour, he went to meet his Maker...
I was able to arrange a wonderful funeral for him within 12 hours of his death, and his body is now resting in a beautiful place. I believe he laid up such treasures in heaven for himself while he sojourned here on this earth that he now has an amazing palace to live in for eternity.
We had the kind of friendship that I will probably cry when I think about him for the rest of my life, just as I cry about Argie, my beloved childhood doggie, even nearly 50 years since his passing. He was probably as loving as Marcel was, so I bet he has a beautiful palace to live in too... I am looking forward to seeing them and all the other animals that have been in my life over the years when it is my time to take leave of this earth.
Thank you for sharing such a touching and heartwarming story about Marcel. He was clearly a special cat with a loving and compassionate nature that even extended towards those who were struggling. Most animals, I would imagine, would shy away. Marcel had remarkable karma, and innate goodness. It's inspiring that you were there for him in his final moments, and how you were able to provide him with such a peaceful and dignified passing. I'm sure he knew how much you loved him and appreciated everything you did for him. I'm also glad to hear that you were able to give him a beautiful funeral and that his body is resting in a special place. It's clear that he left a lasting impact on your life and that he will be remembered with love and fondness. I've had cats all of my life, and currently have a boy who is also a very special gentleman. I hope he will emulate Marcel's goodness and live his life just as well and as long. Thank you again for sharing.
You are most welcome. I was unfortunately not able to have a kitty of my own as a child, due to allergies of a family member. While I did later live in a few households with housemates who had cats, Marcel was my first kitty of my very own. We met when he was perhaps 3 months old and living outside, and he moved in with me 3 months later. So he spent almost his entire life with me. Lalcia and I, and I am sure Marcel as well, wish you and your special gentleman many long years of health and happiness together :)
Many thanks :-)
"Um, just in case we’re unclear, I’d gladly put a 9mm round in your face, just as I would any rabid animal to put it out of its misery, so, you know, don’t think I actually like you as a person."
I think what I might have done would be to say, "Hmm... I'm not miserable and it's not catching. So there's no need for that 9-mm round." But to be on the safe side, I probably would have reported him to the authorities.
Where I live, it is a criminal offense to threaten people. I agree with this. And reporting it is probably the best thing to do in that particular legal environment, because it is essentially impossible to avoid serving prison time if you kill someone, even if it was in self-defense. The only difference is that you'll serve 7 years instead of 25.
But then again... it is nearly impossible for civilians to have firearms here. You can have them for hunting or sports purposes, but there are very strict rules about registration, training and storage that must be complied with in order to have a firearm. It is probably impossible to own or otherwise possess such a weapon without the authorities being aware of it.
His threats weren't congruent with the rest of our exchange, and even if they had been, meh.
Still... he should not be allowed to just threaten people with impunity. This is not conducive to a safe and harmonious environment for all. He's not doing his fair share of the work to make that happen.
Words inherently have an emotionality to them; yes they might just be 'words' but copy writers and marketing exist because they know the words you use and how you use them has an impact whether you want them to or not.
I assume it's the same for a psychopath too, just not in the same way. I.e. you see a food described in a certain way, or people talking about how good this certain food is, etc. Which I guess may make you want to also try it? (Is that true for you?)
For me when I saw the word "HA!" I felt both an accusatory finger pointing at me, as well as his delight. Then with the gun death threat, I just felt "bruh he's lost the plot"...
How do you not care what someone says when it's hit your heart before you had the chance to cognitively disregard it as worthless?
I don't have the inclination to try something based on someone's description of it. It's interesting, but advertisement is totally wasted on me. Nothing about the words, the visuals, the enticement has any effect on me. I find it all to be noise and a waste of time.
I wanted to add to this comment because advertising works because social association, relationships, kinship, authority and hierarchy work with neurotypical people. I claim such things are essential to building societies, which the psychopath is mostly "blind" to, except as an external mechanism to observe and exploit like physics. This is liable to produce enemies, and one day one of the smarter ones will get his wish, even if the psychopath had no malevolent intentions :(. Fortunately there are places where psychopaths are "useful" and when assigned those roles, they become an asset to societies.
The unique situation that Athena has, for example, will only work if there are people that care enough about her to facilitate her survival.
Athena, I understand that your parents were exceptionally patient and understanding and played such a role in your life. It is remarkable to hear these exchanges, and I wish I could leverage more of this. I think that the way to translate what you are imparting to neurotypicals (let alone empaths like me!) is to, as you are doing, speak in terms of boundaries. And to me this way of putting it brings considerable profit.
I somehow still wish I could enhance your boundary descriptions with language that discriminates the feeling dimensions from the factual ones, which are, for neurotypicals, just two types of "factual" dimensions (because the feelings connected with relationships, exchanges, and behaviors do in fact amont to pertinent facts in the progress of the group affected at large).
"I somehow still wish I could enhance your boundary descriptions with language that discriminates the feeling dimensions from the factual ones"
Are you able to elaborate on this a bit so I can understand what it is that you would like? It seems like it could be interesting, but I am not certain that I am clear about exactly what you mean.
Hi Athena, I had a while to think about your inquiry and it's really hard for me to express the categories right. (By the way, It was perhaps equally moving to read your account the second time, because I wanted to see how to best answer, and paid close attention to your line of reasoning concerning responses to abuse or threats).
Something I said at a meeting recently is that there are people who are more focused on reality, and others on appearances, because perception is important to neurotypical people. Now on the one hand, I tell people that, for me, truth is an absolute value, come to me what may, but on the other hand, I respond strongly emotionally to human interaction in many circumstances, including often online.
But when others are expressing something with the purpose of trying to get a response, it takes understanding that fact -as such- that this is the context to understand their behavior in.
But there are also other scenarios where strong feelings and unconcious behavior result. For example, when dealing with dominant individuals who are using being in command in social situations, their behavior causes group dynamics as such. Most people choose to go along because it is expedient, while a minority will respond constructively or also defiantly instead. now describing the boundaries in play with such situations would be of extreme importants for people who want to understand more sophisticated bullying styles, and also politics in groups.
So are we talking about social dynamics being scripted by conscious and/or unconscious intent (emotional or otherwise) by those that are in positions or power or focus?
9mm to the face doesn't bother me at all. I would tell him what happened the last time someone put a 9mm in my face. I made the guy pay me so I didn't take his gun from him and use it on him. Psychopathy in a high stress situation is like a superpower. Since, you have no stress or fear you stay calm, cool, and collected and figure out how to take control of the situation with confidence and charm.
This reminds me of an incident I heard about back in my Society for Creative Anachronism days. A couple of friends were returning from a feast in full garb, including swords strapped to their waists. And some guy pulled a switchblade on them, saying, "Here's 6" of steel saying that you're going to give me your wallets." They just pulled out their (live!) swords and said, "We'll up you 30 inches. Lay your wallet and your watch on the ground in front of us and get the f*** out of here." He realized he didn't really have any choice, so he complied...
That's funny
PS For some reason, I am not able to reply directly to your condolences concerning the departure of my Marcel, so let me thank you here and mention that he was a very good boy. He was friendly and kind to everyone. I remember in particular one time when a friend had a psychotic break and got evicted from her apartment with nowhere to go, so she ended up at our place looking visibly disturbed. He could have been forgiven for being afraid of her. But he wasn't. He and my other kitty spent the night keeping her warm and ensuring she had a peaceful sleep. He was so impartial in his kindness that it made no difference, for example, whether he had any reasonable expectation of getting fed by the person in question. I hope I can honor his memory by following his worthy example :)
I have noticed some weirdness in the comments section as well, and found that on the main page with the entire comment tree there is not a reply option, but going to the comment itself directly from the email link that only has that person's comment displayed, there I can find the reply. I don't know why that is at the moment, and hopefully Substack fixes it.
Your kitty sounds like he was an awesome boy
Well, it seems you have found a workaround. And now that I was scrolling through all of the comments, I saw the reply button for your original comment.
Yes, he was awesome. Even at the very end of his life, weak as he was, he took the attitude that as long as love is there - and he meant by that a good deal more than just feelings, it definitely meant actions too - it's all good. And when the time came, he died peacefully in my arms with no need for assistance from his doctor. In that we all have to die sooner or later, the manner of his passing was probably the best anyone could have hoped for. And thanks to a bit of help from an old friend of ours, he's resting in a beautiful place now. I'm glad we were able to give him such a worthy and dignified send-off.
Indeed. I remember being highly amused when I heard about it from one of the sword-bearing gentlemen in question :P
As a very much none psychopath I always appreciate your stuff on dealing with setbacks.
One of the positive psychopathic traits is they seem to have extreme grit, something I’ve always been working on getting.
It's interesting seeing it referred to that way. To me, it's just an ordinary thing.
At first, I agreed with you. As long as the jackass was entertaining, what difference does it make what he says? But, like you, I am anonymous online, so people like that don't usually bother me unless they're misleading other people. Then, I might challenge them, or ask for evidence for what they're saying.
But, after much thought, and with the realization that most people have public identities online, I consider the death threat, no matter the motive or even if in jest, should result in the guy being immediately banned. He could have simply said that he did not like you. I think he was trying to get some reaction, and didn't have any real desire to kill you. But my objection to this kind of language is from a desire for there to be some degree of civility in online communication. That sort of talk, and far worse, has terrorized a lot of public figures, and their families, and it should result in a ban, or even criminal charges, and mental health checks.
I understand your perspective
To me that death threat was transparent like freshly washed glass, so I chuckled. This transcript was entertaining and I found myself appreciating the... Not sure if to call it sparring because he sure was striking, but against a block of titanium, so no fight on the other side, except maybe in figuring out what is the aim of Mr User.
Now if I am dealing with an actual conflict, here's what plays a role - do I think they are acting the way they are because I upset them (and it's not the sort "well, facts")? Then I feel bad. Do I think they have a point? I feel bad, I wonder how hard will be rectifying, if I can integrate their point with what seems like I shouldn't discard (or plain it hurts to discard (because both can happen - there is valid aspect to the issue, or I am just too invested in something or both at once)), worry whether there is something wrong with my cognition and direction that I did not recognize this sooner (I know, that's why we exchange opinions, to broaden our visions, but sometimes it is not ignorance, but something like colour-blindness or some such issue). Also sense of responsibility and feeling sure I did all in my power to improve whatever problem arose. Because not wanting to be that bystander that could have done something and did nothing. In case I am sure I did my part and the rest is on the other party, I might still actually worry about where is my world headed and how it could impact me and what I care about in long run or what it proves about people, civilization, stuff. And the last thing - if I think the person is serious, how likely they are to really endanger me.
Which doesn't mean I stress over every dissatisfaction and critticism and goading into fight. Depends on how big it is. And perhaps on whether I am already stewing in something and this conflict seems related to it. I can experience also joy of being victorious in handling things to my satisfaction. I can also deem soemthing to be totally over nothing and of zero impact and just rise my eyebrows or not even that.
Last time I got offended was when I showed my father a drawing which featured a weapon design and his reaction was "you don't know much about that stuff, do you?" because I do know more than him, I am the one who lowkey is into historical weaponry and spent months watching vids on history, combat and weaponry. I was angry that I didn't have as much to show for it as to not induce that reaction and I was angry that one of issues he pointed out was something I literally recalled seeing explored in one such video, but forgot to take into consideration. When we discussed what's wrong with the drawing and I pointed out that the original objection he haf was moot, because he misunderstood the drawing a bit, I felt already better, but the fact that it was still a bit less stable than a pretty obvious third option and it was that very thing I saw and didn't recall, that still burned a bit, but it was already milder and actually moving cosntructively. I also felt very ridiculous for how strong was my initial reaction. The thing also was that I was inda figuring along the way how to make it look while I was drawing so that too, but that is a mistake in itself. And the fact that my knowledge is theoretical, while he has practical experience with physical mechanics of tools and that is a real weak spot on my part, that certainly added to the whole sense of humiliation and need to defend myself. And I deeply appreciate constructive critticism, but this took me off guard in quite a way. Great source of annoyance can be, when I feel like I do not have a way to prove how things are and I am feeling sure that I would be seen like making up the explanation.
On the matter of defending one'đ honor, I think there might be some generational ingrained model for that, because it was often required that the isulted accused party does not shrug it off, but meets the challenge and proves they are not to be trifled with. If they ignored it, they might have seriously hurt their reputation within their community. So that could perhaps play into tendency to get all reactive. Of course, there are ways to meet the challenge and one can meet the challenge without actually feeling strongly about it.
I'd say when it comes to insults etc. a fairly good brake on emotional overreaction could be notion that that is exactly what the attacker wants. Oneđ' defense and self-prservation is not getting riled up and seeing it for something we should not let us hurt.
Very good explanation about "why even care". I care about opinions that gives me people whom I value on intellectual and emotional level. Lately I had one "friend" , who came of really rational, but deep down was so sensitive. I realise to better cut off friendship because I was hurting his feelings. He started to act so bothered and defensive, when i said my opinion about him or random things.
That certainly can make things difficult. I know the type of person you are describing.
Not only by those in power, but by all participants, who have various "playbooks", most of which are to minimize inconvenience and maximize prosperity and standing/respect from the group
Humans interaction is certainly interesting
Hmmm.... I responded precisely as you did and gawked in non comprehension at the other comments here.
It also reminds me of real discussions I have had. People try to start on me. Like guys try to get difficult. And when they do because they don't get a fear response they kind of deflate. Mostly what happens is they will say something that is meant to be provocative but I respond to it in a factual manner, and I will just give them more information. Also, I remember a homeless guy associated with a church tried to get me to pity him and I just responded normally (so like a normal conversation - not including emotional manipulation), and a friend of mine at the time thought this was hysterical saying that this guy had tried his Trump card on me. Trying to get me to pity him, and it had fallen flat.
The idea though of responding to endless hypotheticals is not one I agree with. Because I have often thought unless the hypothetical is at least somewhat related to real life, there might be a very good reason said hypothetical cannot happen. But you can throw a knife. I used to do it clear across my room and into the wall.
I have had very similar experiences, and it is always super interesting to see them double down and try harder for that pity response. When it falls flat they realize that they have nothing left in their playbook.
Well... they don't try harder with me. They really realise quite deeply I'm not going to get it - the response I give is so matter of fact and outside the norm. I do understand subtext and hinting and all that but unless there is a compelling emotional reason to pretend to respond to it, I will not. I have actually got better at it. Sometimes a hug will suffice. It only takes a few seconds.
What I find most interesting about these interactions... and I suppose I am uncomfortably moving away from my image of myself when I was more highly stressed. Is that, with the pity plays that are very intelligent and strategic, once the wool is pulled over an NT's eyes, or even worse someone more vulnerable than an NT. They will not see it not matter what. It is like the NT does the doubling down for the ... what is often the narc.
The allergy to seeing the manipulator as anything other than an angelic victim is utterly illogical. Because considering that the person is not a genuine victim does not actually detract from enabling them while it is still only considered as an abstract.
This psychopath Hunter as I call it, what does he expect to find? Duh 🙄
Given the context, I was mostly amused by those exchanges -- although that death threat was certainly startling. However, if it had been a personal (and neurotypical) friend who was the "target" of this person's curiosity, I believe I would have felt indignant and protective. What I might have *done* about that, dunno. I've learned the hard way not to jump on my white horse and ride to the rescue. (LOL)
The whole "why should I care what this person thinks" is stellar. I find it a tad harder to let go of caring what someone else *does*, especially actions aimed towards me. I do have a motto though, when I can remember it: namely WWAD = What Would Athena Do? (LOL) When I can remember that, it does help me uncouple from some situations. (Thanks, Athena!)